{"id":840,"date":"2004-10-18T14:56:19","date_gmt":"2004-10-18T13:56:19","guid":{"rendered":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/wordpress\/blog\/kompositorische-innovationen-1979\/"},"modified":"2025-02-15T23:57:40","modified_gmt":"2025-02-15T22:57:40","slug":"kompositorische-innovationen-1979","status":"publish","type":"post","link":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2004\/10\/kompositorische-innovationen-1979\/","title":{"rendered":"Kompositorische Innovationen 1979"},"content":{"rendered":"<p>Eben ausf\u00fchrlich mit P.B. telefoniert \u00fcber Reger, Bach, Beethoven und allerlei. Dabei fiel dann das Wort von kompositorischen Innovationen. Irgendwer meinte in der Newsgroup de.rec.musik.klassik Beethoven sei nicht innovativ gewesen. Das ist auch egal, ob ja, ob nein. Der Begriff der Innovation trifft nichts Wesentliches im Fach der Komposition. Ich war n\u00e4mlich auch einmal innovativ, habe, zwar zu sp\u00e4t, daf\u00fcr in Unkenntnis 1979 einmal repetitive Musik erfunden (was man heute gemeinhin aber falsch als Minimal Music zusammenfasst).<\/p>\n<p>In meinem wenig beachteten op. 1 \u201eZyklus der Kunst f\u00fcr Violine solo\u201c gibt es ein St\u00fcck mit dem Titel \u201eDer Fotoapparat\u201c.<\/p>\n<p><img data-recalc-dims=\"1\" loading=\"lazy\" decoding=\"async\" data-attachment-id=\"839\" data-permalink=\"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2005\/01\/wittgenstein-noch-einmal\/attachment-der-fotoapparat\/\" data-orig-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2004\/10\/20041018-fotoapparat.jpg?fit=500%2C367&amp;ssl=1\" data-orig-size=\"500,367\" data-comments-opened=\"0\" data-image-meta=\"{&quot;aperture&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;credit&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;camera&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;caption&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;created_timestamp&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;copyright&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;focal_length&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;iso&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;shutter_speed&quot;:&quot;0&quot;,&quot;title&quot;:&quot;&quot;,&quot;orientation&quot;:&quot;0&quot;}\" data-image-title=\"Der Fotoapparat\" data-image-description=\"\" data-image-caption=\"\" data-large-file=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2004\/10\/20041018-fotoapparat.jpg?fit=500%2C367&amp;ssl=1\" class=\" size-full wp-image-839\" src=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2004\/10\/20041018-fotoapparat.jpg?resize=500%2C367&#038;ssl=1\" alt=\"Der Fotoapparat\" width=\"500\" height=\"367\" srcset=\"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2004\/10\/20041018-fotoapparat.jpg?w=500&amp;ssl=1 500w, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2004\/10\/20041018-fotoapparat.jpg?resize=300%2C220&amp;ssl=1 300w\" sizes=\"auto, (max-width: 500px) 100vw, 500px\" \/><\/p>\n<p>Das war gedacht als Programmmusik im einfachsten Sinne. Teil a) da wird der Apparat zusammengeschraubt, Teil f\u00fcr Teil. Die Takte f\u00fcllen sich also Note um Note. Genauso geht es mit der repetitiven Musik bei Steve Reich oft auch; nur eben ohne dieses Bild. Eingebaut in Teil a) ist auch ein Fehler, der in Teil c) [16tel m\u00fcssen von Ton zu Ton gleiten, schmieren!!! Nur Glissandi dieser T\u00f6ne, nach Belieben verl\u00e4ngern] dann zum Versagen des Fotoapparates f\u00fchrt. Teil b) [kr\u00e4ftig energisch, dann gef\u00fchlvoller werdend] handelt vom Handeln beim Verkauf, bei dem sich die beiden Partner gegenseitig ann\u00e4hern und einigen.<\/p>\n<p>Das St\u00fcck, mit einem Wort, war innovativ, nur hat es keiner bemerkt und es war auch nicht innovativ, denn Musik dieser Machart gab es ja schon, nur wusste ich es nicht. Der Vergleich zu Eroberung der Integralrechnung bei Newton und Leibniz bietet sich da noch an, w\u00e4re aber etwas vermessen.<\/p>\n<p>So kommt es, dass hier ein junges Talent, unentdeckt, innovationsreich startete und in Konventionen endete.<\/p>\n<div class=\"shariff\"><ul class=\"shariff-buttons theme-white orientation-horizontal buttonsize-small\"><li class=\"shariff-button mastodon shariff-nocustomcolor\" style=\"background-color:#563ACC\"><a href=\"https:\/\/s2f.kytta.dev\/?text=Kompositorische%20Innovationen%201979 https%3A%2F%2Fwww.kritische-masse.de%2Flogbuch%2F2004%2F10%2Fkompositorische-innovationen-1979%2F\" title=\"Bei Mastodon teilen\" aria-label=\"Bei Mastodon teilen\" role=\"button\" rel=\"noopener nofollow\" class=\"shariff-link\" style=\"; background-color:#6364FF; color:#6364FF\" target=\"_blank\"><span class=\"shariff-icon\" style=\"fill:#6364FF\"><svg width=\"75\" height=\"79\" viewBox=\"0 0 75 79\" fill=\"none\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\"><path d=\"M37.813-.025C32.462-.058 27.114.13 21.79.598c-8.544.621-17.214 5.58-20.203 13.931C-1.12 23.318.408 32.622.465 41.65c.375 7.316.943 14.78 3.392 21.73 4.365 9.465 14.781 14.537 24.782 15.385 7.64.698 15.761-.213 22.517-4.026a54.1 54.1 0 0 0 .01-6.232c-6.855 1.316-14.101 2.609-21.049 1.074-3.883-.88-6.876-4.237-7.25-8.215-1.53-3.988 3.78-.43 5.584-.883 9.048 1.224 18.282.776 27.303-.462 7.044-.837 14.26-4.788 16.65-11.833 2.263-6.135 1.215-12.79 1.698-19.177.06-3.84.09-7.692-.262-11.52C72.596 7.844 63.223.981 53.834.684a219.453 219.453 0 0 0-16.022-.71zm11.294 12.882c5.5-.067 10.801 4.143 11.67 9.653.338 1.48.471 3 .471 4.515v21.088h-8.357c-.07-7.588.153-15.182-.131-22.765-.587-4.368-7.04-5.747-9.672-2.397-2.422 3.04-1.47 7.155-1.67 10.735v6.392h-8.307c-.146-4.996.359-10.045-.404-15.002-1.108-4.218-7.809-5.565-10.094-1.666-1.685 3.046-.712 6.634-.976 9.936v14.767h-8.354c.109-8.165-.238-16.344.215-24.5.674-5.346 5.095-10.389 10.676-10.627 4.902-.739 10.103 2.038 12.053 6.631.375 1.435 1.76 1.932 1.994.084 1.844-3.704 5.501-6.739 9.785-6.771.367-.044.735-.068 1.101-.073z\"\/><defs><linearGradient id=\"paint0_linear_549_34\" x1=\"37.0692\" y1=\"0\" x2=\"37.0692\" y2=\"79\" gradientUnits=\"userSpaceOnUse\"><stop stop-color=\"#6364FF\"\/><stop offset=\"1\" stop-color=\"#563ACC\"\/><\/linearGradient><\/defs><\/svg><\/span><span class=\"shariff-text\" style=\"color:#6364FF\">teilen<\/span>&nbsp;<\/a><\/li><li class=\"shariff-button bluesky shariff-nocustomcolor\" style=\"background-color:#84c4ff\"><a href=\"https:\/\/bsky.app\/intent\/compose?text=Kompositorische%20Innovationen%201979 https%3A%2F%2Fwww.kritische-masse.de%2Flogbuch%2F2004%2F10%2Fkompositorische-innovationen-1979%2F \" title=\"Bei Bluesky teilen\" aria-label=\"Bei Bluesky teilen\" role=\"button\" rel=\"noopener nofollow\" class=\"shariff-link\" style=\"; 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Dabei fiel dann das Wort von kompositorischen Innovationen. Irgendwer meinte in der Newsgroup de.rec.musik.klassik Beethoven sei nicht innovativ gewesen. Das ist auch egal, ob ja, ob nein. Der Begriff der Innovation trifft nichts Wesentliches im Fach der Komposition. Ich war n\u00e4mlich auch einmal innovativ, [&hellip;]<\/p>\n<div class=\"shariff\"><ul class=\"shariff-buttons theme-white orientation-horizontal buttonsize-small\"><li class=\"shariff-button mastodon shariff-nocustomcolor\" style=\"background-color:#563ACC\"><a href=\"https:\/\/s2f.kytta.dev\/?text=Kompositorische%20Innovationen%201979 https%3A%2F%2Fwww.kritische-masse.de%2Flogbuch%2F2004%2F10%2Fkompositorische-innovationen-1979%2F\" title=\"Bei Mastodon teilen\" aria-label=\"Bei Mastodon teilen\" role=\"button\" rel=\"noopener nofollow\" class=\"shariff-link\" style=\"; background-color:#6364FF; color:#6364FF\" target=\"_blank\"><span class=\"shariff-icon\" style=\"fill:#6364FF\"><svg width=\"75\" height=\"79\" viewBox=\"0 0 75 79\" fill=\"none\" xmlns=\"http:\/\/www.w3.org\/2000\/svg\"><path d=\"M37.813-.025C32.462-.058 27.114.13 21.79.598c-8.544.621-17.214 5.58-20.203 13.931C-1.12 23.318.408 32.622.465 41.65c.375 7.316.943 14.78 3.392 21.73 4.365 9.465 14.781 14.537 24.782 15.385 7.64.698 15.761-.213 22.517-4.026a54.1 54.1 0 0 0 .01-6.232c-6.855 1.316-14.101 2.609-21.049 1.074-3.883-.88-6.876-4.237-7.25-8.215-1.53-3.988 3.78-.43 5.584-.883 9.048 1.224 18.282.776 27.303-.462 7.044-.837 14.26-4.788 16.65-11.833 2.263-6.135 1.215-12.79 1.698-19.177.06-3.84.09-7.692-.262-11.52C72.596 7.844 63.223.981 53.834.684a219.453 219.453 0 0 0-16.022-.71zm11.294 12.882c5.5-.067 10.801 4.143 11.67 9.653.338 1.48.471 3 .471 4.515v21.088h-8.357c-.07-7.588.153-15.182-.131-22.765-.587-4.368-7.04-5.747-9.672-2.397-2.422 3.04-1.47 7.155-1.67 10.735v6.392h-8.307c-.146-4.996.359-10.045-.404-15.002-1.108-4.218-7.809-5.565-10.094-1.666-1.685 3.046-.712 6.634-.976 9.936v14.767h-8.354c.109-8.165-.238-16.344.215-24.5.674-5.346 5.095-10.389 10.676-10.627 4.902-.739 10.103 2.038 12.053 6.631.375 1.435 1.76 1.932 1.994.084 1.844-3.704 5.501-6.739 9.785-6.771.367-.044.735-.068 1.101-.073z\"\/><defs><linearGradient id=\"paint0_linear_549_34\" x1=\"37.0692\" y1=\"0\" x2=\"37.0692\" y2=\"79\" 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der Kritischen Masse"],"post_class":[["post-840","post","type-post","status-publish","format-standard","has-post-thumbnail","hentry","category-enzyklopaedie-der-kritischen-masse","tag-eigenblut","entry","has-media"]],"author_avatar":["<img alt='' src='https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/501e6823cd63847c2e8d3e53092cfbaf5f572cd136981466e10cf90502235bec?s=96&#038;d=blank&#038;r=g' srcset='https:\/\/secure.gravatar.com\/avatar\/501e6823cd63847c2e8d3e53092cfbaf5f572cd136981466e10cf90502235bec?s=192&#038;d=blank&#038;r=g 2x' class='avatar avatar-96 photo' height='96' width='96' loading='lazy' decoding='async'\/>"],"featured_video":null,"jetpack-related-posts":[{"id":8274,"url":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2004\/10\/kompositorische-innovationen-1979-2\/","url_meta":{"origin":840,"position":0},"title":"Kompositorische Innovationen 1979","author":"der huflaikhan","date":"18. Oktober 2004","format":false,"excerpt":"Eben ausf\u00fchrlich mit P.B. telefoniert \u00fcber Reger, Bach, Beethoven und allerlei. Dabei fiel dann das Wort von kompositorischen Innovationen. Irgendwer meinte in der Newsgroup de.rec.musik.klassik Beethoven sei nicht innovativ gewesen. Das ist auch egal, ob ja, ob nein. Der Begriff der Innovation trifft nichts Wesentliches im Fach der Komposition. Ich\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;die Kunst&quot;","block_context":{"text":"die Kunst","link":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/category\/angriffauf\/die-kunst\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"Mahnmal, ganz dicht","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2005\/08\/20050725-eisenman10.jpg?fit=500%2C351&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]},{"id":73,"url":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/1996\/07\/adorno-und-die-zwoelftontechnik\/","url_meta":{"origin":840,"position":1},"title":"Adorno und die Zw\u00f6lftontechnik","author":"huflaikhan","date":"31. Juli 1996","format":false,"excerpt":"Adornos kompositorische und theoretische Auseinandersetzung mit der Zw\u00f6lftontechnikEinleitungZu Adornos Musikphilosophie liegen bedeutende und umfangreiche systematisch angelegte Studien vor, die haupts\u00e4chlich um die \"Philosophie der neuen Musik\" und\/oder die \"\u00c4sthetische Theorie\" zentriert sind1. Bisher haben Adornos \u00c4sthetik, Musikphilosophie und Musiksoziologie den musikwissenschaftlichen Ehrgeiz sehr viel st\u00e4rker herausgefordert als konkrete musikgeschichtliche Probleme.\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Texte&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Texte","link":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/category\/texte\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":1593,"url":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2006\/01\/mozart-irrtuemer-oder-mozarts-irrtuemer\/","url_meta":{"origin":840,"position":2},"title":"Mozart Irrt\u00fcmer; oder: Mozarts Irrt\u00fcmer","author":"huflaikhan","date":"20. Januar 2006","format":false,"excerpt":"Volker Hagedorn will in der ZEIT popul\u00e4ren Irrt\u00fcmern begegnen, die mit Mozart verbunden seien. Zum Beispiel: Mozarts Musik sei einfach: Mozart sei doch \u00bbeinfach\u00ab, meinen viele und pfeifen dazu die Kleine Nachtmusik. Dabei f\u00e4ngt die schon ziemlich durchtrieben an. Verschobene Betonungen, Kreiselbewegungen, Fragezeichen \u0096 man muss diese Musik nicht erst\u2026","rel":"","context":"Mit 1 Kommentar","block_context":{"text":"Mit 1 Kommentar","link":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2006\/01\/mozart-irrtuemer-oder-mozarts-irrtuemer\/#comments"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":8317,"url":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2006\/01\/mozart-irrtuemer-oder-mozarts-irrtuemer-2\/","url_meta":{"origin":840,"position":3},"title":"Mozart Irrt\u00fcmer; oder: Mozarts Irrt\u00fcmer","author":"der huflaikhan","date":"20. Januar 2006","format":false,"excerpt":"Volker Hagedorn will in der ZEIT popul\u00e4ren Irrt\u00fcmern begegnen, die mit Mozart verbunden seien. Zum Beispiel: Mozarts Musik sei einfach: Mozart sei doch \u00bbeinfach\u00ab, meinen viele und pfeifen dazu die Kleine Nachtmusik. Dabei f\u00e4ngt die schon ziemlich durchtrieben an. Verschobene Betonungen, Kreiselbewegungen, Fragezeichen \u2013 man muss diese Musik nicht erst\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;die Musik&quot;","block_context":{"text":"die Musik","link":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/category\/angriffauf\/diemusik\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"Reinigung. Foto: Hufner","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/11\/bad.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1","width":350,"height":200,"srcset":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/11\/bad.jpg?resize=350%2C200&ssl=1 1x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/11\/bad.jpg?resize=525%2C300&ssl=1 1.5x, https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2018\/11\/bad.jpg?resize=700%2C400&ssl=1 2x"},"classes":[]},{"id":696,"url":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2004\/08\/1813-dr-hufner-analysiert-beethoven-wellingtons-sieg-oder-die-schlacht-bei-vittoria-op-91\/","url_meta":{"origin":840,"position":4},"title":"1813 \u0096 Dr. Hufner analysiert: Beethoven, Wellingtons Sieg oder Die Schlacht bei Vittoria op. 91","author":"huflaikhan","date":"19. August 2004","format":false,"excerpt":"Quirinus sagte in seinem Beitrag \u201eRoll over Baghdad\u201d, dass \u201cauch Beethoven und andere hehre Herren \u0085 Soundtracks zum Krieg geschrieben\u201d h\u00e4tten. Dabei verweist er auf Beethoven op. 91: Wellingtons Sieg oder Die Schlacht bei Vittoria. Das ist sicherlich nicht falsch. Aber es ist auch nicht ganz richtig. Ich erinnerte mich,\u2026","rel":"","context":"In &quot;Enzyklop\u00e4die der Kritischen Masse&quot;","block_context":{"text":"Enzyklop\u00e4die der Kritischen Masse","link":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/category\/enzyklopaedie-der-kritischen-masse\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"","src":"","width":0,"height":0},"classes":[]},{"id":1009,"url":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/2005\/01\/taktlos-85-komponisten\/","url_meta":{"origin":840,"position":5},"title":"taktlos #85: Komponisten","author":"huflaikhan","date":"13. Januar 2005","format":false,"excerpt":"Sind sie Klempner oder K\u00fcnstler, was machen sie \u00fcberhaupt, welchen Sinn hat das eigentlich. Dar\u00fcber gibt taktlos in der 85. Ausgabe durchaus ein paar Antworten. Die gute Pepa hat gestern dankenswerterweise darauf hingewiesen. Zu Gast waren Manfred Trojahn (siehe Foddo), Georg Hajdu und J\u00f6rn Arnecke, der j\u00fcngste im Bunde. Na,\u2026","rel":"","context":"In \"K\u00fcnstler\"","block_context":{"text":"K\u00fcnstler","link":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/tag\/knstler\/"},"img":{"alt_text":"Manfred Trojahn","src":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2005\/01\/20050113-trojahn.jpg?fit=500%2C367&ssl=1&resize=350%2C200","width":350,"height":200},"classes":[]}],"jetpack_sharing_enabled":true,"jetpack_featured_media_url":"https:\/\/i0.wp.com\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-content\/uploads\/2004\/10\/20041018-fotoapparat.jpg?fit=500%2C367&ssl=1","public_identification_id":"e7f69ff7e6b64e4290485d55e5411091","private_identification_id":"e7159273e8c9455092e7d13d8f792425","_links":{"self":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/840","targetHints":{"allow":["GET"]}}],"collection":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts"}],"about":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/types\/post"}],"author":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/users\/2"}],"replies":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/comments?post=840"}],"version-history":[{"count":0,"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/posts\/840\/revisions"}],"wp:featuredmedia":[{"embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media\/839"}],"wp:attachment":[{"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/media?parent=840"}],"wp:term":[{"taxonomy":"category","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/categories?post=840"},{"taxonomy":"post_tag","embeddable":true,"href":"https:\/\/www.kritische-masse.de\/logbuch\/wp-json\/wp\/v2\/tags?post=840"}],"curies":[{"name":"wp","href":"https:\/\/api.w.org\/{rel}","templated":true}]}}